Javier Ramirez Lugo: [00:00:00] Was this scary a hundred percent. Um, was I, you know, did I know what I was doing? I thought I did. Um, now I, I think I know a little bit more, but, but it's in that like conviction to find early success and really listen to the market. Um, and what the market told me was that there was appetite for that.

And that led me to kind of continue to trust.

All

David Fano: right today, we're with Javier Ramirez Lugo, uh, who, uh, if you're going to notice the recurring theme, if you've listened to a few episodes, him and I worked together at we work. Uh that's you know, it's a recurring theme throughout all the episodes as you leverage your relationships. And, uh, and we're going to talk a lot about that in this episode.

So with that, have you ever want to go, uh, tell us a little bit about

Javier Ramirez Lugo: your. Awesome. First of all, Dave, stoked to be here. Thanks for having me, um, a little bit about myself. I'm from Puerto Rico. I've been in the states for about 16 [00:01:00] years. Uh, start my career in finance and right after that, jumping into the tech world.

And I haven't looked back since, uh, I had the pleasure of running into you. We work, which was a lot of fun. Uh, I learned a lot of great things and, uh, I currently live in Miami, which I know is a city that has a lot for both of us.

David Fano: Yeah. And actually we'll, we'll talk about that. Cause as close as you grew up, when you came to the states, you actually went far away and then found yourself closer.

True. Cool. So. Like you, you've had a really incredible career and you still got a lot of career ahead of you, but, you know, I was looking quickly before our conversation. Your longest job tenure was two years, three months, eh, basically it looked like this is two year, one month, one year, three months, 10 months, two years, three months, seven months, two years, one.

Four rolls of that company is so six months per role. And then now what you're doing, and what that tells me is just like, you're always in motion, always moving up, always iterating. Um, and I don't [00:02:00] think that was by accident and, you know, I think it's, it's an important thing for people to see because so many people worry that, you know, if I move jobs, I'm going to get left behind, but I think it's actually the opposite, um, for you.

Um, at the rate that you were moving, but I just feel like there was an intentionality from the beginning. So when you think about your career, like when was your first real career?

Javier Ramirez Lugo: First of all. I mean, I, I've never heard someone depict my LinkedIn, so, so aggressively. So I wonder if that's what recruiters actually look at.

Um, but you know, it's funny they've because for me, um, career movement has always been about, you know, kind of finding some place that has like the best match for me. Um, and. The first career decision. I think it's like when you go to school, you know, I had majored or dual majored in finance and entrepreneurship.

So for me, it was about like, whether I started in a more entrepreneurial world, which I always knew was going to be the. Or did I go to [00:03:00] finance? And to be honest with you, there was a professor that had had a lot of influence on that career decision from, uh, from the get-go for me, who told us, like, you know, go get your foundation, get your contacts, you know, get your business acumen and then start something.

So that led me to start, uh, on the finance route, um, which, which led me to New York. And I couldn't be more grateful for that opportunity because obviously like, as you go into sales, as you go into other lines of business, having that, that business acumen from the early days has just made such a profound impact in everything that I've done.

David Fano: Well, why'd you pick finance, uh, for school.

Javier Ramirez Lugo: So I like numbers, you know, it's funny. My, my oldest brother, um, had a lot of impact than me. I'm the youngest of three. Um, and my oldest brother was always trading stocks, you know, since a young age. So I remember going to his account and he's like, Hey, you know, use my accounts all good.

And, you know, whatever you make, uh, take it out. And I mean, I wasn't trading millions of dollars or anything close, but it was [00:04:00] like, you know, I made 10 bucks. I would just take it out or whatever. Um, so that really interested me. And I think that. You know, that, that led me to go into finance with an approach of investing of like wealth creation and all these types of things.

And, and because finance had the ability to see so much in business, I always knew that I didn't want to be a doctor, or I didn't want to be a lawyer, which is sort of the traditional sort of career paths that everyone at least back home in Puerto Rico have. Um, so for me it was, it was pretty obvious to go that route.

Oh, that's

David Fano: cool. So it was a, I'm always trying to kind of codify. How people pick their careers. And so yours was kind of like familial influence, but from a sibling and less like from a.

Javier Ramirez Lugo: Funny you asked that. I don't know if this has to do anything with the topic, but, um, my old man is an entrepreneur during the day and a musician at night.

So, um, I knew that was the end game. Um, in fact, if you look at my setup, I have a couple of guitars behind me and people always ask me about them, but, um, it, it was definitely full [00:05:00] familial, um, you know, kind of influence, uh, but also like. Thought that I was thinking longterm since the beginning, because I want it to have that knowledge where I could bring it to the rest of my career.

Whereas I feel like the finance environment where you have to put super long hours, as you might imagine. Um, I wouldn't be able to like probably, you know, do it for somebody else. Now I do it for myself, but you know, early in my career, um, I knew it was the right decision, if that makes sense. All right.

David Fano: That's awesome. I love that you got that. I call it almost like entrepreneurial permission. Cause I've talked to people who, whose parents were, or were not. And just like seeing it gives you such a sense of familiarity with it to be like, oh yeah, I can do that. Versus someone who grew up with no sort of entrepreneurial-ism in their family.

I just like to know that that seems too hard. Right? It's neither one way or the other, but it's just this kind of thing that becomes a known versus an unknown and has this, uh, this like effect on how we think about our current. [00:06:00]

Javier Ramirez Lugo: And I think that they've for me, um, growing up with, with a father and a brother and, and sort of like an entrepreneurial family, I always craved that lifestyle, obviously like in Puerto Rico, the lifestyle is very different because I always joke that people are on island time.

So that hit me pretty hard when I got the Goldman Sachs and had to work 80 hour weeks. Um, but, but it definitely was something that sort of guided me to say, like, that's the kind of life that I want and it's, it's gonna come at a certain point, but I know I need to do a little bit of work. All

right.

David Fano: So you had this professor that gave you this great advice, um, and kind of encouraged you go work somewhere.

So when would you say was like this next fork in the road when you said, okay. I got to think hard about my career here and I got a tough decision and it's going to have, uh, a longer impact.

Javier Ramirez Lugo: Yeah. So. Uh, as I told you, for me, it started with, let me cover my like finance basis, because I just spent, you know, how ever many hundreds of [00:07:00] thousands of dollars in tuition over the last kind of four years in Boston, which by the way, was where I went from Puerto Rico.

And it was a crazy decision because it was really cold, but it was a massive change, but you know, you make the best out of it. And honestly, that's where I started creating the network. What I like about Boston, and this is sort of like a separate point, but it has to do with like the building relationships is that there are so many schools in Boston and people are, you know, there at the same time for the same types of things that you started develop this incredible network that, you know, you carry on forever.

Um, and. As I finished my time in finance, or I didn't know I was finishing it at the time, but finance is very structured environment. Right? So there's, there you go to Goldman Sachs for example, which is where I worked. Um, and your two years as an analyst, you you're part of the analyst program, which is an incredible program and you meet a lot of people through as well.

Um, but then you have to, you know, be the top performer within your let's say analyst class. And then you go to be an associate. You spent three years as an [00:08:00] associate, then you become VP MD. If you're lucky enough, That seemed too structured for me, that seemed like too much of like a, I don't know if I want to be in a structured environment, but also what things we haven't talked about is given my personality.

I, I chose to be within finance, but in the client facing side of finance, which was sales and trading, because I enjoy talking to people. I enjoy solving. I enjoy being part of that dynamic culture, but, you know, given the entrepreneurial or let's call it like musician, gene that I have in me, I always thought about wanting to be.

Like, how can I be part of an environment where I can create and do different things like with within non-structured environments? And listen, it was 2014 financials, a lot more regulated than it was, you know, kind of before oh eight. Uh, but also Silicon valley was just booming. Um, now that it's not yet, you know, but Miami is booming now, so we can say that, um, and.

You know, I, I had that [00:09:00] hunch and it was, it was sort of by the fall, a good friend of mine from Puerto Rico had raised around, um, he gave me a call and he said, listen, man, um, we are, you know, raising around because we need to engage into a commercial activities. We need a sales person. I know you're in sales.

I know you could probably talk to. Configure out, come move to San Francisco. I know it's really far from Puerto Rico. I know it's really far from home, but there's a lot of great things happening here. And I was, I, my, one of my, uh, oldest brothers, like he went to school in California, but he went to school in Pasadena, which is very different than San Francisco.

Um, and you know, I thought about LA. I remember him telling me like, Hey man, I just want you to know San Francisco is not LA. It's not, you know, the roller blades and the beach and the surfing and all that great fun. It's very different. So I asked him to come out and check out San Francisco and see if there's something that I would have enough appetite for.

And I came and I talked to a lot of people. I saw, you know, the, the intensity of everyone talking about tech and, and [00:10:00] everyone together building great things. And I said that. And that's that's, uh, what, what transitioned me from finance into San Francisco? And at first it was crazy because you go from, you know, one of the nicest office buildings and lower Manhattan to a trailer park in, in Menlo park, or, you know, behind the Stanford facilities.

And there were 12 of us. Sometimes I had to go buy lunch for people. Sometimes I have to change the office, you know, kind of printer and all those great things. And I took on the opportunity and figure it out and, and, and it was amazing.

David Fano: So you, well, you were working on standards in pores, then you went to Goldman Sachs.

So two of the most prestigious finance firms and a friend calls you and says, Hey, come, come to the valley and help me build this startup.

Javier Ramirez Lugo: Yeah. And I mean, I, listen. Hi, hi, appetite for risk is, is, is the way I could describe myself. And honestly, I, I knew I was. You know, going against the [00:11:00] grain. I knew I was, you know, doing something that wasn't common, but at the same time, as I told you, I think it's really important when you're looking at your career progression.

There's nothing, I I've always told myself, like, there's nothing you can't do. Um, and it's also a big influence from growing up where my family would always tell me if you want to be a barber, be the best barber out there. Right. So, so that always gave me the confidence of saying like, I'm willing to make this decision.

I'm going to go to Silicon valley. Um, I'm risking the cushy office, you know, the structure and all those types of things. But I know this is where I I'm going to eventually lead my career to because entrepreneurship seems so much more exciting than finance for me. What were some of

David Fano: the things you were given up at that moment?

Like what were like percentage wise? How much did your comp drop, you know, living conditions, just like, w what, just like to frame it for people, like, from this kind of like steady, like, you know, th th everything was on plan. You got the finance degree, you work at the best [00:12:00] finance place to like, what is essentially like the polar opposite, but like, you betting on yourself, the long-term,

Javier Ramirez Lugo: you know, it's funny, you asked that Dave, and I appreciate that question because.

That was such a huge impact from like a lifestyle standpoint, the comp impact was about 50% drop in comp because now you go into a sales role where your base salary, which is what you're guaranteed on a month to month basis, um, is a lot lower. Uh, but the, the other percentage of your compensation is through commissions, right?

Um, and, and that was the first for me, right. That, that was not something that in finance, instead you have a pretty decent base and then you get a pretty decent bonus. Right? So on top of the fact that, um, in finance, there are, um, you know, 401k matches. There are, you know, all kinds of, uh, insurance, like company stock and all those types of things.

The bet that you're making in such an early stage environment is I'm going to give not only [00:13:00] 50% of my cash, but I'm giving up all these ancillary benefits that, you know, make up for the total compensation. And that are very significant, but I'm betting on the equity part. I'm betting that if I go to this company early on, they were a series a at the time that that equity component is going to be so much greater in the long run.

Um, and, and that's the bet that. Right because you got the bonuses and finance. Um, I mean, listen, finance is a great place to make money if that's what you're focusing on, but also given regulation and all those types of things at Goldman. I used to work in a derivative sales desk, which was one of the main reasons why, you know, oh eight happened because of like all these exotic, you know, kind of investments.

Um, so the regulations sort of may the profitability of our desk, uh, you know, be impacted. So there was not as much upside. So I saw the upside in the equity longterm, but the cut that I took, um, again about 50% made me have a very different lifestyle, you know, that, that I had to adjust. And [00:14:00] luckily I've only had been in the workforce for four years at that point.

So I knew I, I had to make an adjustment and it was a strong one for.

David Fano: So you make that leap you're there and now you're teaching yourself also, you had never done B2B sales, never done SAS sales, uh, you know, which I think is also a kind of a bet on yourself, uh, which I think is really cool, obviously high levels of trust from leadership.

Um, cause they knew you. Um, but what, what was that like? Like what what'd you do? Did you start teaching yourself?

Javier Ramirez Lugo: So it wasn't tense and, and, and I got to tell you. For me, that was, uh, I didn't get an MBA because I thought that I was learning so much about tech in this, you know, environment, especially in San Francisco in that time, that the way I did it was, you know, from let's call it like eight to six you're at the office.

I'm asking all kinds of questions. I'm trying to meet with as many people as possible. Um, and then I impose myself my own quota, uh, where I had to meet, uh, four new [00:15:00] people a week and go to three. Um, I mean a single new in San Francisco. So like instead of, you know, kind of sitting down and. I decided to take the event route.

Um, I remember going to event bright founders, uh, you know, kind of chats, fireside chats, um, sales leaders that I, you know, kind of admired. Um, and this was like podcasts were starting to happen. So I listened to a lot of SAS there at the time, which is like one of the leading let's call it like content producers with, within B2B SAS.

Um, and that really helped me to gain an advantage and, and, and sort of learn over the week. Um, I used to cycle and then go back and skim through LinkedIn and try to absorb as much content as possible. Um, I think LinkedIn, uh, back then had had less of a presence of like younger people producing content and more like established guys that were producing content.

Not that it's a bad thing or whatnot, but, um, it, it took me a solid year. I would tell you to really understand what the dynamics, uh, [00:16:00] for, for SAS. Because when you're working for Goldman Sachs, like you have such a huge brand recognition that like, you don't have to do that. Right. You don't have to go find leads.

So when you go to an early stage company that has very little credibility, like doing outbound is, is, is like oxygen. It's like something that you have to do in order to survive. So, so teaching myself, but also believing and trusting that, you know, I could figure it out because it involved a lot of risk taking, you know, I remember.

Uh, we were doing a deal of Intuit at the time, and I was texting with their senior head of HR. And one of the founders told me, would you ever think that you would go from being in finance to actually texting with someone? Uh, so senior within our organization because of finance it's so structured. You don't text, like, you know, kind of the head of HR at Goldman Sachs or Morgan Stanley or anything like that.

Maybe now it's different, but that, you know, sort of helped [00:17:00] me get comfortable. And I had a lot of support from others that, that made me, um, excited about going to work every day. But again, it was about a year of outside work through going to events and teaching myself all this stuff.

David Fano: And while you were at Zenefits, you were early, that was the company, right?

It was 12 people.

Javier Ramirez Lugo: No. So I actually went to UFT before, before. Yeah. And, and, uh, Zenefits is a funny story because. Um, they knocked on my door and as I was like, you know, kind of immersing myself and learning all about these things, I went to an event and I heard, uh, their CEO speaking Parker, Conrad, who I highly regard.

Um, and I was like, wow, working for someone like this has to be such a game changer. And at the time there were looking to build, um, product within their sales organization that would manage. It's a product that competes with Carta, uh, which back then was called iShares. And it was really [00:18:00] at the intersection of my experiences because since I sold derivatives, which are publicly traded options, uh, in some instances, um, they were looking.

To essentially manage private options or like the cap table for companies. And I was the only one that was capable of speaking to a CFO about, you know, 4, 9, 8 valuations and know all these, like, you know, um, different intricacies about options, but also. So for me, it was very obvious at the time they had raised 60 million bucks, like nobody had raised 60 million bucks in a, in a series, a in Silicon valley at the time.

So I went there, I went early and honestly, that's one of the things that like completely changed my career. Zenefits was a complete, uh, boost for everything that I've done ever since I went there. Um, I think that I exponentially grew because the size of growth of that company or the speed of growth of that company really, uh, taught me so many things, which.

Highly recommend anyone to do the same thing earlier, earlier on in the [00:19:00] career. So

David Fano: did they recruit you or were you looking guy? And so w what was the like area industry, or like areas.

Javier Ramirez Lugo: So they sold to HR. Um, they had, um, uh, HR, uh, let's say, uh, employee appreciation, um, product that, that essentially gifted people through gift cards.

Every time someone hit their quota, or every time you welcome someone to the company, they had a platform that allowed you to gift. But instead of just giving you a random Amazon gift card, you were actually gifted something to a local. Right. So for example, you could go to and get a Cuban sandwich, you know, if you get someone in Miami and it's immersing them into the core culture, it's something like thoughtful.

Um, and you know, it had a lot of analytics and BI that it would tell you specifically like how people were using it and how people were happier and whatnot within the organism. Zenefits is, you know, the typical HR sale. Um, you walk in through HR, but then you have to walk into the finance department to sell them the stock [00:20:00] options product.

And that's where I came in. So

David Fano: you had like what? I would call like a career bullseye, right? Cause I got a lot of times. But I always tell people, companies want to hire you for what you did, not what you want to do. Right? Because hiring is risky. If, you know, if the person's never done it before, I wish more companies would take that risk, but a lot of companies can afford to take that risk.

And so they want to hire you for what you've done. And you had this like perfect combination of your two, you know, two major moments of your career that combined together perfectly for what this company was launching.

Javier Ramirez Lugo: Yeah. And, and honestly, It was great. It was an incredible experience. And I felt really comfortable through the interview process.

You know, it was something new that they were experiencing and I later realized that it became such an important role for the company because most of their sales came from the insurance derived. They gave you the platform for free. And essentially they collected the premiums for everyone that they [00:21:00] insured through through their platform.

Uh, but then they realized, like we can't put our eggs in one basket. We can't just make all the money from like the insurance premiums. How do we start developing these add on components? And they started with stock options that later went down a road where they did payroll. They did time and attendance.

And I was sitting there sort of like at the right place at the right time. Which eventually led me to manage, um, you know, a very large team that was selling all these paid products. And honestly, that was like my MBA into SAS, um, is what I could say.

David Fano: And how did they find out about you

Javier Ramirez Lugo: LinkedIn? Um, and, and I can't stress enough how important LinkedIn is.

Um, Uh, Zenefits and we work found me through LinkedIn. Um, so I know a lot of people spend a lot of time on LinkedIn, like brushing it up, making it look nice, like building their brand. Uh, but you just don't know when, when it's going to strike, you know, for me, um, I've always managed, you know, kind of my career [00:22:00] jumps through the relationships that I've been able to build.

Um, and it's been incredibly. Uh, but that sort of has led me to be in a good situation. So when you know, the recruiters doing their own outbound through LinkedIn, you know, and they find me, um, and both of them have been incredible opportunities. All right.

David Fano: So I'm going to assume now a next big moment was I'll call it like that phase, your HR tech phase of your career.

Then a real estate company, uh, comes along where you and I. Cross paths. What, what was that switch? Like? What, like, what were you thinking when you're like, Hey, I know how to do sass. I know how to do B2B. They're approaching me for real estate coworking, but, uh, what was, what was going through your mind?

Javier Ramirez Lugo: A lot of things actually.

So, um, I think I told you earlier, Dave, um, that, that I, when I went to San Francisco, I was like, man, I'm going far from my family. Like, [00:23:00] you know, this is, you know, disruptive to the traditional, you know, Latino upbringing where you stay close to your family and all those great things. So. When I was at San Francisco, you know, after being there for about five years, I loved it and it was awesome, but I wanted to somehow, you know, kind of be closer to home and everything sort of aligned.

And at the time I received, uh, you know, the, my LinkedIn message from Cara Friedman who use, you know, um, and she was looking for a sales manager. Um, in Miami, uh, to figure out sales for the mid markets slash enterprise space, which meant bringing in larger clients or, uh, anchored, let's say tenants and. It was really hard to find a job in Miami, like historically trying to come to Miami and after having competitive salaries and, and, you know, career opportunities in New York and San Francisco, such things just didn't exist in Miami.

And when I got that message, I remember I was like, [00:24:00] wow, really? Um, and it's, it's the type of company that has the New York mentality to New York velocity and speed, but it's based out of Miami. And I get to be closer to home and I get to bring a lot to the table. I was hesitant at first to the same exact point that you mentioned, because the beauty of software is that it's unlimited inventory.

Um, and you can sell as much as possible, but when you go into the real estate world, you have limited inventory, right? Because you're based selling based off an asset that, um, you know, gets to a certain capacity. So. For me, it was exciting cause it was new. And the interesting thing and the debate that was happening, you know, in 2017, right around when these conversations started was that, you know, we were not really a tech company.

It was a real estate, but what I got to identify through the processes that the distribution model was very SAS like, and the speed at which, you know, sales were done and how people were compensated. Just out of like a SAS culture. So for me, [00:25:00] it was a pretty easy decision when I came down here and saw what was happening.

Um, and also there was a little bit of a challenge because Miami in 2017 was a, they call it the stress market, which is really funny because like now it was the complete opposite, but very few big companies wanted to come to Miami. And for me it was a big challenge. Because I said, I understand the culture.

I speak Spanish. I've been in SAS. I managed teams. Like I seen hypergrowth all these things, like, you know, kind of checked off the box and to what we work was was, you know, looking for, but also doing so I didn't really hesitate. Like I think I had more hesitation going from New York to San Francisco then from San Francisco to Miami.

Cause I,

David Fano: so you had four different roles in your two years there. So I think. Pretty quickly. So, so talk to me about some of like the big decisions, um, you know, and then I'll ultimately. Yeah. Leaving.

Javier Ramirez Lugo: Yeah, no, um, listen to, this is just that we were, um, [00:26:00] we're, we're, we're pretty fast, but, but it was, it was a speed that I appreciate, um, you know, kind of working in and it has to probably do with my personality, but, um, I think that I saw it as a test.

I was like, okay. I went from running an enterprise team to being the sales manager in Miami that we work and. You know, pretty soon enough, like the company realized like, Hey, we gotta give this guy a little bit more opportunity. Cause you know, we have five buildings in Miami at the time we were kind of doing pretty good.

Uh, we close a pretty large deal back in 2018. Um, and we were running out of space. So the company sort of like saw the potential and I try to make myself. Available and very nimble in terms of the things that I was willing to do. So what led me to get promoted was, um, I raised my hand for any opportunity available and they told me that you want to manage Texas and Texas has nothing to do with Florida as you know, I mean, but by the fact that we both, I guess, uh, states don't pay state [00:27:00] taxes as the only similarity, I guess.

Right. Um, I said yes. And, and that opened up a lot of doors, Dave, and I think that that's what has allowed me throughout my entire career to always raise my hand and say like, let's go, let's do it. Um, and actually that led me in 2019 to be on a plane. Um, mostly every week I flew about 110,000 miles that year, uh, which was crazy, but I was, you know, flying between Florida and Texas mostly every week because I had a team over there.

I had a team here, um, and that experience and those results essentially led me to be able to grab more states in the Southeast. Um, and it was really like applying the playbook. Uh, you know, Silicon valley and New York mentality to the Southern states that tend to operate a little bit behind in terms of adopting new products or adopting, you know, kind of new ways of working, which is really what we were selling.

Um, and, and again, me being able to raise my hand was [00:28:00] something that led me to that growth and always, you know, kind of saying yes, but with. With, with an eye on, on what I wanted to do. Right. Because I don't, I don't want to, by any means, recommend that I I've always been a yes man, cause I've certainly said no many times.

Um, but, but that led me to grow into leading, you know, kind of the Southeast, which was a great experience. And. You know, we were towards, you know, Q4 of 2019, as you obviously know very well, uh, you know, ran into a couple of different walls, failed our IPO. We had a couple of rifts that sadly made me, you know, kind of let go of a lot of my direct, uh, team.

And in 2020, I was given the option to either stay as an individual contributor or leave. Um, and here's another risk moment where. I'm still thinking about how to solve for the entrepreneurial side of my, my career. And as I reflected, I realize February, [00:29:00] 2020, I have this amazing playbook of different sales environments.

Then I start to get calls from different companies that were looking for sales leaders and. After going through Zenefits, which had a rough ending and we work that, you know, had an interesting ending at a time. Um, I realized like how do I hedge myself and build something where I don't entirely commit, but I hedge myself, which was another career learning from selling derivatives, um, to.

Have, you know, this disperse risk across different companies, but still help them. And that led me to start quota. And that led me to the side, okay. This is my time to leave because now I have the proper experience to teach others how to implement the B2B SAS sales playbook into their organizations early on and be successful.

David Fano: So I think that's something a lot of people try to grapple with is like starting my own business, doing my own thing. And, um, [00:30:00] You know, I always, actually, I default dissuade people from doing it, um, which feels a little hypocritical cause I've done it enough times now that, but, um, I just feel like it's kind of, you're going to be faced with a lot of nos and a lot of rejection, so I'm like, Hey, let me get them started early on that process.

Um, but talk, talk to us a little bit about that initial. Process, you know, kind of how you were able to. Cause I think also a lot of people will think that they just take a deep dive, like plunge, right? In most people that you look at when they start their own company who have done a certain amount of hedging, they did fractional work or they did.

Part-time like, you know, bill gates had a job. Steve jobs had a job. Like they all, actually few people just like rip the bandaid off and do it. So, so teach us a little bit about your transition and kind of how you make.

Javier Ramirez Lugo: Yeah, so full transparency. I did have a client on the side. Um, so, so that gave me a lot of conviction.

Right. Um, and, and a lot of people sometimes say like, [00:31:00] you know, work on your side hustle, uh, until it becomes your full-time hustle and all that kind of stuff. And, and I, I, to a degree did that, but I noticed and realized that in order for me to build a services business, which is how I started, um, I needed.

Right. I'm seeing that the client in my responsibilities, uh, we work, um, I realize I need to spend a hundred percent of my time in doing this. And it was probably one of the scarier decisions I'd done in my career, because first of all, at the time, by the time I made the decision, it was April, 2020, and we were in a global pandemic.

Right. So I was, I was stuck at home, uh, in Miami, uh, with my girlfriend at the time. And. It was so scary because nobody knew what was going to happen. I also caught COVID in March, 2020, and I swore I was going to die. Cause every time that I turned on the news, there was little information or like 24 year olds, 26 year olds all on ventilators.

So I remember waking up and texting my [00:32:00] friend that works at the ER in Miami every day and saying like, Hey, like I can't smell anything. Um, so that added to the anxiety of, of, you know, new project, you know, sitting at home, keep in mind that I was, I was, you know, working in an environment where I was consistently moving around every day because I was showing different locations with my team.

We work, but I, but I see. Certainly more and more people pay attention to the, to the SAS world. Right? The public markets sort of like gave me that kind of a indication that tech was doing good and zoom at the time was crushing it. So I started, you know, kind of to think about like all these companies have a B2B SAS distribution model and they're going to start using zoom.

I've been selling at the time I was using join me and, you know, then zoom and then, you know, all the other platforms that, that do sort of like this video sharing as well. So I, I know how to do that. Like, this is, this is what I've been doing, uh, you know, for the last [00:33:00] couple of years. So why not? And interestingly, interestingly enough, what I did was I can't go company to company.

So, what I went to solve for next was like, how do I find a channel that gives me exposure to a lot of opportunities, right? And this I L I brought from the B2B sales world, right? You find a channel partner, sort of like at Zenefits, we would sell to CPAs, CPAs have a bunch of different clients. So if you land at CPA, it means how you probably get exposure to their book of business, which means like you maybe get 20 clients from that one CPA.

So for me, it was. Um, so how do I get in touch VCs? My friends that have gone into investing into early stage companies and offer them my services because everyone needs to build a sales team and most companies start building, um, you know, as technical founders, but they don't have the commercial experience.

So. I started doing that. And I started getting, you know, a lot of success through that and started packaging, you know, the hours or packaging, the services and that [00:34:00] little by little, let me to have early success. Um, again, which. I sort of had to pull in all of the resources and all the different tools of my experience.

Again, hedging looking at the markets, bringing tools from like Zenefits, um, and, and really doing that, um, as, as a business leader, but, uh, was it scary? A hundred percent? Um, was I, you know, Did I know what I was doing. I thought I did. Um, now I, I think I know a little bit more, but, but it's in that like conviction to find early success and really listen to the market.

Um, and what the market told me was that there was appetite for that. And that led me to kind of continue to trust myself and that that's, that's honestly what, what, uh, what allowed me to keep. You know, I owe it to my personality. I can't sit still a lot. So, um, you know, I'm, I'm always trying to, to figure out, you know, how to, how to go to the next step.

Um, you know, it's, it's [00:35:00] been interesting because like now, as a, as a business owner focus is a big thing, right? So I have to channel that energy of like wanting to move and do 20 things at a time. To figure out how to like with patients build something greater. Cause obviously my ambition is not just to be a consultant.

The rest of my life is how do I productize this into, you know, something that scales and, and I think that's, that's a skillset that, that, um, you know, now learning how to work with is, you know, channel all that energy into the one thing to grow it. Yeah, that's, I'm sure. I'm sure you can tell me a lot more about that, right?

David Fano: How not to do it well. Um, but uh, you know, doing it well, I'm still figuring it out, but, um, have you heard, thank you so much. Um, I know you're active online, um, active in the Miami tech community. How can folks follow along? Get in touch, see all the cool things you're doing. Tap into Cuota. Um, tell us a bit [00:36:00] about how we can, how we can learn.

Javier Ramirez Lugo: Thank you. Uh, Twitter and LinkedIn are the best ways you can get in touch with me. Um, LinkedIn is Javier Ramirez Lugo. I'm on Twitter as having eat you G um, and um, our website is Cuota.io. So anyone that wants. With a C, right. Which is the reason it's sort of a C is because we do a lot of work in Latin America as well.

So that how you spell it, uh, in Spanish, just with a C. So in English, it's a play on words. So it's sort of like target markets. Uh, but yeah, LinkedIn, Twitter is the best way.

David Fano: Awesome links in the show notes on whether it be YouTube or Spotify, you can find links there, um, and have yours also an avid bike rider.

So if you want to get good bike riding tips in Miami, you can get those. But have you ever thank you so much? There was a lot to learn in this conversation and we really appreciate it

Javier Ramirez Lugo: now. Thank you, Dave. Always a pleasure.

David Fano: And that's it for this episode of Non Linear. If you enjoyed today's conversation, make sure to subscribe, share, and rate us wherever you listen to podcasts.
You can learn more about Teal in our website tealhq.com, or follow us on social media @teal_hq. Thanks again, and please join us again to keep hearing about how we make decisions that shape our careers.